December 31, 2009

Tiger Woods and Kobe Bryant

Sponsors are dropping Tiger Woods as an endorser, which suggests to me that some brave marketer could make out like a bandit in the long run by signing Woods cheaply right now to a ten year deal.

After all, look at Kobe Bryant, who is now #10 on the 2009 Forbes Celebrity 100, between #9 Brad Pitt and #11 Will Smith. Bryant currently makes $24 million per year in endorsements, even though he spent 2004 on trial for rape (he got off because the woman, who reached a secret civil suit settlement with him, ultimately wouldn't take the stand against him in the criminal trial). Even though the rape trial, which he would attend during the day in Colorado, then jet to Laker games in the evening, was a huge publicity brouhaha less than six years ago, it has effectively vanished down the media hole. In LA, the only thing bad you ever read about Kobe these days is that he used to squabble with Shaq. There are countless articles about "how Kobe has matured" but they are all about him not being so much of a ball hog anymore. The whole being tried for rape thing has vanished. Winning an NBA title in 2009 changes the past in ways the Ministry of Truth never dreamed of.

Bryant and Woods have fairly similar personalities: intensely competitive, smart about their sports, foolish about marriage, etc. (Bryant married young without a prenup -- his agent didn't attend his wedding). At some point, Woods is going to realize that he's no good at "working on his marriage" and all those other distractions, but he is good at hitting golf balls. So, he's going to go hit a whole bunch of golf balls. Then he's going to go out and win a whole bunch of tournaments. And then, once again, he's going to get paid a whole bunch of money by marketers because, in the big picture, there really isn't much difference between sports fans and the kind of women Tiger likes.

My published articles are archived at iSteve.com -- Steve Sailer

61 comments:

Anonymous said...

Rumor has it that Kobe's marriage was a shotgun wedding at the behest of the bride's parents to get out of a statutory rape rap--or, at least, he was the only NBA star whose personal life fit a blind item in the NY Post at the time.

Anonymous said...

there really isn't much difference between sports fans and the kind of women Tiger likes

Ouch.

jody said...

no doubt about it. as soon as woods gets back into a PGA major and approaches the lead, almost every one of his previous fans will become huge fans again.

all he has to do is win 1 or 2 majors and he will immediately be "the greatest comeback story in sports history!" and resume his laughable position as the best athlete in the world, according to american sports losers, er, i mean american sports writers and sports casters.

the cheering, the drooling, the slobbering will all return. the overwhelming sense of how badly some middle aged white guys want the mixed race golfer to beat all the white golfers will be just as palpable as it was before. woods will lead all ESPN golf coverage, and the player who actually wins any tournament will be very, very secondary to covering woods and how he performed, as they have been for almost 10 years now.

let the "greatest comeback in history!" begin.

jody said...

the lakers won the 2009 NBA championship mainly because mitch kupchak traded kwame brown for pau gasol. one of the most one sided trades of the decade.

the lakers immediately went to the final the first year gasol joined the team, and then won it the next year, after previously spending several years getting bounced in the first round.

how former number 1 overall draft pick kwame brown avoids the constant, endless bashing that ESPN doles out to other athletes who are among the biggest busts in their respective league's history, is mystery. oh wait. no it's not.

Mitch said...

But don't you think Tiger knows this, and so wouldn't sign up for any cheap deals? He'll just wait it out and get the big money when it comes back.

Vernunft said...

oh good, I was wondering "is there a seething racist angle on this?" and jody delivered

edwin said...

Great article and so true. Hopefully Tiger comes back soon. He made a big mistake(who hasn't?) but it's time we all move on. I wish and his family him the best after this medai slaughter he underwent.

Anonymous said...

the lakers won the 2009 NBA championship mainly because mitch kupchak traded kwame brown for pau gasol. one of the most one sided trades of the decade. the lakers immediately went to the final the first year gasol joined the team, and then won it the next year

Some of the trades in the NBA are so lopsided, and so heavily favor the teams in the big markets [Danny Ainge got KG and Ray Allen for the basketball equivalent of a wooden nickle, a wad of used bubble gum, and a stinky old sock] that you have to wonder whether the fraudulence of the officiating extends to some kind of fraudulence in the front office.

Truth said...

Meanwhile, in another galaxy, 12 million light years from White Natiolonia...

Anonymous said...

Truth,

If Charlie Sheen had been reading Roissy, he'd know how to pass a sh*t-test without actually losing his cool, which is probably how that whole thing blew up.

Sheen cheated on Denise Richards, who at the time was a quite beautiful woman (and is still pretty), and has had a very bad reputation as a whore-monger and womanizer for years (a guy who has dated porn stars, chased strippers, slept with Heidi Fliess's troupe of professional call girls). Is it any wonder he has *finally* gotten in trouble with the law over a woman? One wonders just how much cocaine Sheen has provided strippers with over the last two-and-a-half decades? (Pun on his current TV show only half-intended)
How many benders have hookers since the famously heavy-drinking Sheen witnessed? (Sheen got plastered every night during the filming of Wall Street, and you can see it in how puffy his face is in every frame he is in during the movie, his slow reactions during the film contrasted with Michael Douglas's intensity and timing).


Truth, if Charlie Sheen is the poster "white-bad-boy", vs. the usual suspects over at the thugreport.com, we will take him.


Happy New Year Truth. : )

Anonymous said...

The other part of this is that the kinds of people who really like Tiger Woods and make the endorsements pay for themselves (how many VPs of this or that have cited him in their wildly inspirational pep talks?), aren't really outraged that an incredibly rich, powerful and successful guy would have sex with women who aren't his wife.

This is just like the whole Imus episode except with sex and follows Steve's point that it's a status game. It's a lot of fun to show how virtuous you are by tearing down Tiger. Deep down I suspect that many golf fans really think Woods' biggest mistake was how stupid he was about handling these women, not that he did it in the first place. In fact, I bet that's how the conversations go after a few single malts in the clubhouse. Once Woods starts going out and being really good at golf again, this will largely be forgotten by golf fans.

Anonymous said...

But Truth, we've known for years that Charlie Sheen was a disaster. And he has never had an army of jock sniffing media hacks and fans covering for him.

TW otoh has been pretty well invulnerable until recently.

Anonymous said...

Michal said:

Being from Central Europe (Czech Republic) I've always been astonished how big a deal Woods is in the US (judging from media coverage, Michael Wilbon talking about him as without a doubt the biggest sport celebrity in the world or something to that effect etc.) Almost nobody cares about golf in my country and I think that applies to whole Continental Europe as well. Is golf really that popular in America or is it just media touting him so much because he is black/multiracial?

James Watson is Right!!! said...

Truth, you are right, Charlie Sheen is creepy. Watching "Two and A Half Men" made me a skeptic of the whole idea that whites are the master race. There is no way the white race could conquer the world on genetic superiority alone, and create a show that horrible. What is your explanation for this paradox, Sailer.

Anonymous said...

there really isn't much difference between sports fans and the kind of women Tiger likes

But is there a difference between golf fans and the kind of women Tiger likes?

I wonder if Tiger's golf game benefitted from the sense of control he felt about his private life, about somehow managing to keep his stable full of mistresses completely under raps from the press and his wife. But then Steve posted that article about positive thinking.

Meanwhile, in another galaxy, 12 million light years from White Natiolonia...

Ah, but Troof, as you yourself would point out (did point out, in the case of Keanu Reeves) Sheen is actually...Hispanic! (birth name: Estevez)

Black Sea said...

" . . . he [Bryant] got off because the woman, who reached a secret civil suit settlement with him, ultimately wouldn't take the stand against him in the criminal trial."

As I remember the case, it was by no means open and shut. I believe she had a history of mental instability, had made a point of going uninvited to his hotel room, and didn't appear particularly upset or traumatized to those around her shortly after the event.

I realize that some people will say that all of this is immaterial, but in a case of "he said, she said" it may lead a jury to doubt the woman's testimony.

Shouting Thomas said...

Seems like Tiger should just go after a new set of endorsements. How about:

o Viagra
o Playboy
o Trojan condoms
o Etc., etc.

There's a whole world that is the opposite of his former image.

Embrace it, Tiger.

Steve Sailer said...

"Is golf really that popular in America?"

Golf, a Scottish game, has been a big deal in the Anglosphere since the 1920s. Bobby Jones received two tickertape parades down Broadway (1926 and 1930). It's not part of the Olympics, so it was never promoted in the Soviet bloc, but it's a big deal among businessmen and politicians (such as Obama) in English-speaking countries and in the Far East.

Steve Sailer said...

Golf is like Formula I racing on the European Continent and in South America: very big in terms of endorsements because its top guys are seen as highly competent.

Anonymous said...

Maybe this is off-topic but I just don't get this whole celebrity endorsement thing at all. I just can't see myself buying a razor blade, car, or whatever because Tiger Woods tells me to. I can't think of one single thing I've ever bought in my life because of a commercial. I just don't get this at all. I don't blame the celebrities for taking the money (who wouldn't?) but I don't see why marketers think it helps them. Woods in particular was an whoring shill. He would push any product for money. You can easily see he is only touting the product because he is being paid. Why people would be so dumb (or be believed to be so dumb) is beyond me.

Anonymous said...

"Sheen is actually...Hispanic! (birth name: Estevez)"

Charlie Sheen's mother is a white American and his paternal grandfather is from Spain. He has no significant non-European lineage. That hasn't helped him much, because he shot Kelly Preston in the arm in 1991 and pleaded guilty to battering another girlfriend in in 1997. He has a long pattern of domestic violence, to say nothing of the hookers, porn stars and cocaine.

cedarview ln said...

There's one crucial difference between kobe and tiger. NBA players never had much of a moral reputation to begin with. One could be 'bad' and still be popular. Indeed, the 'bad boy' image could even be a plus: Detroit Pistons. Though Kobe was never a premier 'bad boy', what he's been selling is the image of the big tough hunk.

Tiger, on the other hand, was sold as something more than a super athlete. He was the Colin Powell of golf. He was milk chocolate.

Just as Jesse Jackson and Obama gained power and popularity for different reasons--Jackson as a BLACK guy and Obama as a BLITE guy(black guy as white people want him to be)--, Tiger had something more than athleticism. Indeed, his success in golf was less threatening to many white people since golfers aren't hulking he-man types. To be sure, Tiger's success in what had previously been a white-dominated sport may have upset some whites, but Tiger had maintained a dignified 'white' demeanor and personality. Had Tiger Muhammad Ali-zed the sport by showboating, it might have been a different story. But, Tiger acted more white(or Asian)than black. Thus, his recent scandal is all the more embarrassing. Charges against Kobe may have been graver, but rape charges against basketball and football players have been commonplace and something we've all come to expect. But, Tiger sold himself as a 'different kind of black athlete'.

It's true enough that our morally degraded society will forget the scandal. If Michael Jackson was mourned as a 'great man' and if Obama can become president despite his ties to Wright and Ayers, Tiger is sure to make a comeback. Besides, most discussion about Woods have tended to be humorous than morally grave or condemnatory.

There is one difference between Tiger and other black athletes though. Most blacks tend to be shameless in public. They not only seem unembarrassed by scandal but revel in it. Tiger, on the other hand, doesn't seem comfortable acting in this mode.

cedarview ln said...

"Maybe this is off-topic but I just don't get this whole celebrity endorsement thing at all. I just can't see myself buying a razor blade, car, or whatever because Tiger Woods tells me to."

You're missing the point. Only rich successful companies can afford celebrity endorsements; so, the real message is 'we are big, powerful, and important enough to buy celebrity endorsements.'
The assumption on the part of the consumer is that certain companies can afford celebrities because they have made a lot of money by selling a superior product.

Anonymous said...

Is golf really that popular in America?



For some reason, yes. It used to be the game of stuffy businessmen types but has become a popular pastime for middle America as well.

It remains a sorry excuse for a sport though.

Anonymous said...

Watching "Two and A Half Men" made me a skeptic of the whole idea that whites are the master race. There is no way the white race could conquer the world on genetic superiority alone, and create a show that horrible.





There's no neccessasry relationship between the ability to conquer the world and the ability to create great art. Rome left no legacy of wonderful art behind it. (Architecture aside.)

That said, you cannot judge our entire culture by one crappy TV series.

Big Bill said...

Easy, Truth. Carlos Estevez (aka Charlie Sheen) of mixed Irish and Mexican Catholic heritage, comes by his drunkenness, patriarchal attitudes and violent domesticity honestly.

Dagger John did a great deal of good by civilizing the Irish immigrants to American standards of sobriety and responsibility, but obviously his work is not complete. Would that Mexicans and other NAMs had similar civilizers.

Anonymous said...

Can anyone find out the IQ's of these two? I'm curious as to what's between the ears of these athlete role models. Before I run out and buy the products they endorse, I'd like to know more about their cognitive abilities.

Truth said...

Discuss it amongst yourselves.

David Davenport said...


STREETWISE

2010 Musings; Will Tiger's Loss Be Nike's Gain?

By MICHAEL SANTOLI AND ANDREW BARY | MORE ARTICLES BY AUTHOR

...

THE FALLOUT FROM TIGER WOODS' acknowledged extramarital affairs might benefit the bottom line at Nike, Woods' prime sponsor, if it convinces the maker of athletic shoes, clothing and gear to curb its costly endorsement deals with top sports figures and teams, one Wall Street analyst says.

"Regardless of how corporate sponsors respond to this specific controversy, we believe the trend away from high-profile, multimillion-dollar celebrity and athlete endorsements has been growing for some time, and 'Tiger-gate' could be an inflection point," Credit Suisse's Omar Saad wrote last week in a research note entitled "Tiger Woods Fallout: Another Nail in the Coffin of the Expensive Endorsement Era."

Saad calls the Woods situation the latest embarrassment for corporate sponsors who've paid a lot for the endorsements of the likes of quarterback Michael Vick, swimmer Michael Phelps and golfer Michelle Wie that have "generated questionable results." Vick, now with the Philadelphia Eagles, went to jail for his involvement with illegal and grisly dog-fighting, and the highly touted Wie has been a bust, winning just one minor tournament on the women's professional tour. And a photo appearing to show Phelps using marijuana made the Internet.

Saad's view is that athletic sponsorships aren't worth what they once were because cameraphones, blogs and paparazzi, combined with a ruthless gossip business, have made it much tougher for celebrities to hide indiscretions. "Most importantly, consumers intrinsically understand that these endorsements go to the highest bidder and do not necessarily reflect true brand loyalty," he observes.

... (MORE)

David Davenport said...



Woods, for instance, promoted Buick until General Motors' financial woes ended the relationship in 2008. Even before then, many wondered about the value of that endorsement because it was hard to believe that Woods was truly a fan of staid Buicks with their generally much older base of drivers. (His famous accident occurred in a flashy Cadillac Escalade, a vehicle beloved by rappers, movie stars and pro athletes, not the kind of folks who spend weekends watching the U.S. Open.) And what was Woods' connection to Accenture, the international consulting and outsourcing firm?

Woods now is poison for sponsors. Accenture has dropped him, Gillette has put him on "hiatus" and watch-maker Tag Heuer is scaling back its use of him. But Nike (ticker: NKE) is sticking with Woods -- at least for now -- in a lucrative endorsement deal that may pay the world's No. 1 golfer $30 million annually, Saad estimates. A Nike spokesman wasn't available for comment.

Nike and Adidas (ADS.Germany), the German maker of athletic footwear and clothing, are fierce rivals for endorsements by individual athletes and teams, particularly outside the U.S. "While many believe that Nike and Adidas need to bid aggressively for sponsorships, we think the reality is that they determine the market price," Saad wrote, adding that he thinks the Tiger mess will cause them to "realize that they are systematically overpaying...especially given the growing risks."

Nike alone may spend more than $1 billion annually, or 5% of its $20 billion in sales, on sponsorships. Saad argues that Nike should prune its list of endorsements by renewing only 75% of expiring contracts, and that it should cut its payments on new contracts by 35%. If Nike were to do this over three years, the estimated life of the typical endorsement contract, its profits could rise by 33 cents annually, or by $1 after three years. That's not trivial, relative to Nike's projected earnings of $3.70 a share in its current fiscal year, which ends next May.

In the end, the Woods scandal could be one of the best things to happen to Nike and its rivals in recent years. Are you listening, Phil Knight?


http://online.barrons.com/article/SB126118069863797821.html#articleTabs_panel_article%3D2

Anonymous said...

he shot Kelly Preston in the arm in 1991 and pleaded guilty to battering another girlfriend in in 1997. He has a long pattern of domestic violence, to say nothing of the hookers, porn stars and cocaine

I just googled charlie sheen 9-11 truther and got 198 MILLION hits.

Whiskey said...

Steve, your are off base here. The more likely comparison is between Charlie Sheen and Tiger.

Tiger got dropped by AT&T, and Accenture, and dialed back a lot by TAG Heuer and others, because Tiger appealed to men as the model of hard work, self-control, moderation, and so on. Tiger lost his appeal by being basically, an out of control Rap star, not too far off from P-Diddy.

Charlie Sheen, by contrast, is unlikely to be dropped by Hanes because Sheen's bad boy antics appeals to women. The more bad boy he is, the more women love him. Hanes ads after all are not aimed at men (who cares about Jordan now, Sheen's costar in the Hanes ads?) The Hanes ads are of course aimed at women, to get them to buy the stuff for their guys.

Shaq has ads running, for Icy Hot, I NEVER see ANY Kobe Bryant ads. AFAIK Bryant has NO SPONSORS! Bryant had McDonalds, and a bunch of others. That NEVER came back.

Going by Brett Favre and Peyton Manning, an aw-shucks, non-arrogant, good old boy style is what works for male-oriented ads.

Tiger is like Kobe, can earn directly from his athletic prowess (but is getting older) but has lost forever the more lucrative sponsorship deals. Woods pulled in $100+ million per year from sponsorship, and its not coming back. Why would it? Woods is ARROGANT and his permanent status as Tabloid joke will get him plenty of (as predicted) fawning sports/golf coverage, but not sponsorship deals.

How many TV commercials does Kobe have, again?

Bottom line: women love the bad boys, guys do not. Don't underestimate male jealousy either (over women). Woods is more P-Diddy vs. his careful image of middle class sobriety.

corvinus said...

Any way to buy Tiger Woods stock cheaply right now? Too bad he doesn't have his own company. Or does he?

Anonymous said...

Why do women even like Charlie Sheen? Do women consider him good looking? Couldn't actresses date someone better than him? I don't get it.

Anonymous said...

HE MADE A MISTAKE(WHO HASN"T)

I wish I could have mistakes like that. My MISTAKES just aren't that much fun.

He isn't even going to pay for this mistake,although it's more than a mistake, it's a lifestyle. He'll lose some money,but he doesn't need anymore.
Most of us will go back to our mediocre jobs and wait to die and he will get more money and women in the future. That is why I don't pay money to watch sports or go to movies. Why make these guys rich?

David said...

Truth, Dirty Charlie's rep was that he's a s--t. Tiger's rep was that he's a god. People love to see big men fall. Charlie had nowhere to fall to. Tiger fell like Lucifer. So the knives gleefully came out for him, while most people just can't give a dayy-umm about gutter Chuck.

It's true a lot of white onlookers felt resentful of the excessive fawning Tiger received. But then so did a lot of sportswriters, after the fifth beer.

Vernunft said...

"Rome left no legacy of wonderful art behind it."

Ovid? Virgil?

Anonymous said...

I think you all have it wrong - all the companies that have dropped Tiger so far have a huge interest in marketing to women and probably have women on their leadership teams. The rise of women in the business world is what is driving the vast amount of animus towards Tiger - nothing to do with what he actually did being regarded differently.

James Watson is Right!!! said...

"Discuss it amongst yourselves."

Truth, I would like to warn you that the crypto-white nationalist types on Sailer's blog would blame Larry King's philandering on his Jewcy Jewness. Bill Clinton, David Letterman, Mark Sanford, and John Ensign are already fine examples of the sexual integrity of the white race ;)

PS: Two of them are Republicans.

Captain Jack Aubrey said...

Nike alone may spend more than $1 billion annually, or 5% of its $20 billion in sales, on sponsorships. Saad argues that Nike should prune its list of endorsements by renewing only 75% of expiring contracts, and that it should cut its payments on new contracts by 35%.

I go through athletic shoes the way Tiger Woods goes through mistresses. I'm sure Nike's done plenty of research trying to determine the return it gets on its investment from endorsements.

However...I've tried most major brands of athletic shoes - Reebok, Adidas, New Balance, etc. - and in my experience Nike just plain damn makes a superior product. Every so often I try out a different brand and I invariably regret it.

Captain Jack Aubrey said...

Truth, I would like to warn you that the crypto-white nationalist types on Sailer's blog would blame Larry King's philandering on his Jewcy Jewness. Bill Clinton, David Letterman, Mark Sanford, and John Ensign are already fine examples of the sexual integrity of the white race ;)

800 million or so whites, but whatever you say.

"Data" is not the plural of "anecdote."

Nobody's arguing that all white men are pure as the driven snow, but shall we compare AIDs rates? Abortion rates? Divorce rates? Out-of-wedlock birth rates?

Anonymous said...

"Rome left no legacy of wonderful art behind it."

Ovid? Virgil?






I rest my case.

Anonymous said...

Why do women even like Charlie Sheen? Do women consider him good looking? Couldn't actresses date someone better than him?





I've heard this rumour that women are attracted to rich and famous men.

Anonymous said...

I would like to warn you that the crypto-white nationalist types on Sailer's blog would blame Larry King's philandering on his Jewcy Jewness.


I'm amused that anyone can say even in jest that there are "white nationalist types" on this blog. Some people need to check out actual white nationalist blogs. They're nothing like this one.


Last I checked, Jews are white people. Uber-white people.

stari_momak said...

Nike just plain damn makes a superior product.

I find that for running -- Nike's original business -- Saucony and Asics are far superior. Probably not coincidentally, neither company does much in the celebrity endorsement, or even advertising.

Dutch Boy said...

Thank the Lord I've lost most of my interest in sports (so I can't be lumped in with the kind of women Tiger likes!). Speaking of sports, how 'bout the NBA jocks who got into a locker-room argument over a gambling debt that ended up with a gun drawn? Technical foul?

Pissed Off Chinaman said...

Jody,

Being the sport of choice for upper middle class professionals I am dragged to the course to particpate in the mind numbing sport every so often. The only thing more boring than playing golf is watching other folks play. And the only thing dumber than watching golf, is watching cheering for golfers based on their race.

David said...

James Watson is Right!!! said

> the crypto-white nationalist types on Sailer's blog would blame Larry King's philandering on his Jewcy Jewness. <

I'm a White Nationalist, and I don't think Larry's philandering was caused by his Jewishness. His Jewishness probably had a lot to do with his initial prominence, though.

(PS: Larry's a Democrat.)

Pissed Off Chinaman said...

Oh and I don't get why everyone is so shocked that a pro-athlete cheats on his wife with multiple women. I'd be more surprised if one remained faithful....now that would be a story.

David said...

Steve said:

> there really isn't much difference between sports fans and the kind of women Tiger likes <

Didn't you refer to the latter as "skanks and whores"?

Steven Sailor. Pissing people off since 1991.

Happy New Year.

Tim said...

"Truth, I would like to warn you that the crypto-white nationalist types on Sailer's blog would blame Larry King's philandering on his Jewcy Jewness. Bill Clinton, David Letterman, Mark Sanford, and John Ensign are already fine examples of the sexual integrity of the white race ;) "

The argument of Southern segregationists against integration was that if segregation was banned whites would adopt black sexual behavior. They have been proved right over the last fifty years.

Truth said...

"The argument of Southern segregationists against integration was that if segregation was banned whites would adopt black sexual behavior. They have been proved right over the last fifty years."

Oh brilliant there Tim; and I take it that integration was responsible for the lasciviousness of ancient Rome, the French renaissance, Don Juan, Casanova, Lord Byron, Catherine the Great and the Roaring 20's also?

James Watson is Right!!! said...

"The argument of Southern segregationists against integration was that if segregation was banned whites would adopt black sexual behavior. They have been proved right over the last fifty years."

Than explain to me why men like Alexander Hamilton were having affairs before Jim Crow was even conceived.

David said...

Tim said

> The argument of Southern segregationists against integration was that if segregation was banned whites would adopt black sexual behavior. <

No, the argument was that there would be an epidemic of black-on-white rape, given the sexualized nature of black men. The argument has been proved right. The stats just a few years ago for interracial (black and white) rape: about 35,000 b-on-w, and 10 (that's 1.00 X 10.00) w-on-b. As for other racial crime, check here (pdf).

Forced integration came at a large and largely unreported cost, and it continues to do so. Segregation was not an irrational policy. Nor was lynching inexplicable or useless. But these points are absolute sacrilege and must never be stated, must less examined.

Anonymous said...

Steve, you use to be a market researcher and I assume that entails looking into why people make purchasing decisions, so here's a question for you (or anyone else here): Do celebrity endorsements really influence peoples purchasing decisions to an extent that it makes the huge sums they receive for their endorsements worthwhile? I have trouble fathoming why someone would, say, buy a buick just because Tiger is hocking them. I can't imagine a celebrity endorsement affecting my decision to buy something. But then again, maybe I'm just strange.

Harkleroader said...

"The argument of Southern segregationists against integration was that if segregation was banned whites would adopt black sexual behavior. They have been proved right over the last fifty years."

"Than explain to me why men like Alexander Hamilton were having affairs before Jim Crow was even conceived."

++++++++++++++

Because he wasn't simultaneously having affairs and shamelessly singing & shaking his ass about them.

Tom V said...

Pissed-off Chinaman:

Being the sport of choice for upper middle class professionals I am dragged to the course...

We already know, POC, that you're a high-power corporate lawyer with an IQ in excess of 150 (thanks for sharing, by the way). But I would never have guessed that you're also a sport!

The Chinese are such overachievers.

Captain Jack Aubrey said...

Forced integration came at a large and largely unreported cost, and it continues to do so. Segregation was not an irrational policy. Nor was lynching inexplicable or useless. But these points are absolute sacrilege and must never be stated, must less examined.

Indeed. One cost was the shake-down by the black power structure which drove whites from the cities. Sprawl, anyone?

Another was the loss of informal social mechanisms to hold down black crime rates. Whites can't defend themselves. Say what you will about lynching, but it affected fear on the violent subset of blacks not really motivated by anything else.

Another was the loss of classroom discipline. Kids (the ones who didn't care to learn) used to routinely get kicked out of schools for even minor infractions. Now they have a "right" to be there and a "right" to learn, as if teachers can even make them.

Democracy cannot survive in a nation with a large, serf-like population where the serfs actually get to vote. Jim Crow segregationists understood that.

But all i can say is congrats for getting that one past Komment Kontrol. Most of my posts seem to make it. It's the ones of that nature which generally don't.

Truth said...

"The stats just a few years ago for interracial (black and white) rape: about 35,000 b-on-w, and 10 (that's 1.00 X 10.00) w-on-b. As for other racial crime, check here"

Yeah, and 150 years ago, the stats were reversed; so effing what?

"Forced integration came at a large and largely unreported cost"

Yes, largely at a cost to lazy white guys who wanted to continue to live of their grand-daddy's money and reputations. My heart bleeds.

"Segregation was not an irrational policy."

Black people in Africa, and the Japanese promoted segregation. It was European and American whites who invented integration.

"Nor was lynching inexplicable or useless."

Well there is that obscure thing called "The Bible"...

"But these points are absolute sacrilege and must never be stated, must less examined."

I for one WELCOME examination of these points, I would just rather you do it in a way that shows you have a requisite level of intellect. Case in point:

"Because he wasn't simultaneously having affairs and shamelessly singing & shaking his ass about them."

I think the term WTF? applies here. Hey good news though, it looks like I have a sidekick. We're going to be like the Dark Knight and Boy Wonder.

Your asses are grasses and Truth and JWiR are the lawn mower!

Pissed Off Chinaman said...

Tom V,

High powered corporate lawyer?

I'm an associate rather than a partner, so I am more like a glorified house slave.

That being said, I still maintain golf is really boring to watch or play. I don't know how anyone can stand it or how pro-golfers get so rich off of it.

michael gilchrist said...

I think Tiger's refusal to address his mistakes will cost him a lot of fans, and this year will be a great test of whether he can overcome the same associated with his behavior.